Chad Cain 2006 Chat
Jan 18th, 2006 by OutdoorsFIRST
Modified Jan 18th, 2006 at 12:00 AM
Slamr: MuskieFIRST Welcomes back to our Chat Room, Chad Cain, of Chad Cain’s Guide Service and Musky Armor, thanks for coming Chad! Chad_Cain: 4-5 mph Steve_Worrall: Chad, welcome Magruter: welcome, thanks! Chad_Cain: Thanks guys! Pointerpride102: thanks for bein here chad! Slamr: Chad, can you tell us about your trolling set ups? Chad_Cain: I run six rods, two on boards, and four flat lines most of the time Slamr: how deep are you running? Chad_Cain: I don’t troll near as much as I cast though Magruter: how do you run your flat lines? Chad_Cain: two deep, two shallow Pointerpride102: chad do you run a bait in the prop wash….i hear some guys do that? sled: are you fishing now in your home state? Chad_Cain: deep right near the bait fish depth, and shallow is up high in the water column Chad_Cain: I would be but I am busy making Llungen Tales right now! esox50: any particular baits that seem to outperform others on shad based reservoirs? Chad_Cain: I only run baits in the prop wash on sunny days Pointerpride102: ok sled: saw your spot in the badfish video and interested in your cold water presentation Duane: what is your best tactic for targeting fish in March? Chad_Cain: My target all the time on shad reservoirs is first finding the shad, then worry about muskies Slamr: lets slow the questions, and let Chad catch up for a sec Chad_Cain: We are fishing right now, water is still open Slamr: baits for the shad based waters? sled: do you see different “patterns” or pile size, structure of shad? sled: and does it change your tactics?Chad_Cain: What ever your favorite trolling baits are. Most work. I like Believers, Legends, Ernies, Chad_Cain: sled, I don’t understand the ?? madmusky: How many 50s or better in 05′ Chad? sled: do you see different size of bait “herds” and does it relate to active muskies? Chad_Cain: 8 of them Chad_Cain: I always look for larger schools of shad. The more shad, the more muskies that relate to them. I like trying to catch many fish in a short period of time during a feeding window!Slamr: Chad, how do you deal with the muddy waters that occur on Kinkaid? Duane: In early season are you casting shallow most of the time? Chad_Cain: Noisy baits smiling_mallard: hey Rod Slamr: such as? Chad_Cain: In early season, the fish move in and out of the shallows a lot with the different weather patterns. Chad_Cain: Rattle traps, jointed Believers Duane: What are the water temps in early March ussually? Chad_Cain: 40 degrees Duane: Thats cold!! Chad_Cain: just as long as the lake is open, game on!! Slamr: can you tell us a bit more about your early season approaches on Kinkaid, and how they evolve as the water warms? Chad_Cain: The fish spawn around the beginning of April down here. The patterns don’t change much, but the bite can get more consistent with stable weather Duane: have you used any live bait on Kinkade? Pointerpride102: What would be the best plan of attack in Mid March? Chad_Cain: I tried some spotted suckers from the lake, and didn’t catch any. Chad_Cain: FInd the warmest water on the lake, find out where the shad are hiding for the day, and work the heck out of that area Pointerpride102: ok Steve_Worrall: Chad, you have several other guides working with you, right? sled: do the shad move to warming water? Chad_Cain: Yes Steve Chad_Cain: sled, the shad are always searching for food and warmer water in the spring madmusky: Why do you only prop wash on sunny days? just from personal experience? or is a method of reducing sunlight on a high sky day? Duane: What is your personal best from Kinkade? Chad_Cain: On cloudy days, I usually troll much deeper. Sunlight brings the plankton to the surface, the shad follow, and so do the muskies. Sunny days are great for catching fish very high in the water colum Jmusky: what are your best baits for 40 deg water temps? sled: what kind of water temp. range can you see on a given sunny day Chad_Cain: 49 x 24.5″ Duane: Nice fish! Pointerpride102: How far is Kinkaid from Milwaukee? Chad_Cain: water fluctuates a ton on the surface, but try getting it two feet down Chad_Cain: 7-8 hours BruceKY: Chad, I read where you like to cast 10″ jakes to match the gizzard shad. Will this work for lakes with thread fin shad? what baits do you recomend when you are fishing tread fin based lakes? Chad_Cain: smaller baits. I use big baits on Kinkaid since are shad average much larger. I like to stick near the size of the available forage or bigger. Pointerpride102: Chad how has your degree in fisheries biology helped you in your career as a guide? Chad_Cain: A TON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Slamr: how so? Pointerpride102: Help understand fish movements and relations to temps and stuff? Chad_Cain: Understanding the lake as an entire ecosystem and learning every part of it, not just the muskies Duane: Duane Schreiner-Bulletproof Tackle Chad_Cain: Understanding thermoclines, oxygen content, predator-prey relationships, solar movements, etc Brandyn_Shepherd: Mr. Chad Cain… got a question about the Muskies up in Vermilion when you have the chance. Slamr: from a biological perspective, what is one thing that you think all muskie anglers should learn? the one main thing Steve_Worrall: look at the system and apply that to the fish? Chad_Cain: forage movements and how muskies relate to them Slamr: moving on to Vermillion….what temps do you leave Kinkaid and head north? Chad_Cain: 80 degrees sled: when did they start the Vermillion stocking program? Chad_Cain: Right around the first or second week of June madmusky: Why did you make the jump from Leech to Vermillion for the majority of your time? Chad_Cain: I am not sure about Vermilion Chad_Cain: More scenic, and Vermilion was tougher to crack than Leech Duane: What do use besides Lungen tails on BigV? Steve_Worrall: you caught your personal best there last year, right? Chad_Cain: Spinnerbaits, topwaters, bulldawgs, cranks Chad_Cain: Yes, I got a 55″ Steve_Worrall: tell us that story, please Chad_Cain: She hit while I was guiding a guy and his nine year old boy!! That was the first fish that I couldn’t move, and I actually hatd to follow her out to deep water with the trolling motor Steve_Worrall: what bait? Chad_Cain: She also wouldn’t get straight in a Big Kahuna in order to measure her in the net Chad_Cain: In-line bladed Llungen Tale madmusky: which basin did you catch more fish out of this year? east or west? Which one do you spend more time on? Duane: Chad-I have got to get back to work Chad_Cain: I fish both sides a lot. I just move with the big schools of ciscoes and whitefish. They tell me where to go madmusky: see any bigger than 55 last yearBrandyn_Shepherd: Chad I fished the west end last year from July 9th-15th… It was very interesting. After days of wind pounding the west end, we found groups of fish behind a small island. sled: what’s the first thing in your mind starting a day looking for the bait fish and how to you use the boat and electronics to do it Brandyn_Shepherd: The strange thing is they were 3ft below the surface just sitting in weeds… Would not move unless you were right on top of them. Chad_Cain: No. That was actually the biggest fish I saw all year. I did lose one that was close to that on the same spot about a month later Brandyn_Shepherd: Do you know why these fish just sit and not move? Even when the sun is high and the lake is like glass? Steve_Worrall: 55″ is a HUGE fish, certainly big enough! Brandyn_Shepherd: There had to be over 40 fish in one bay just sitting…throughout the week they started to move down the shoreline and I hooked two 50″+ Chad_Cain: THey are comfortable in the warm water. Their preferred water temp is 67-72 degrees. Wait until a feeding window and see what they act like!! Brandyn_Shepherd: They would not hit when they were just sitting motionless. Chad_Cain: It is tough to catch fish when they are no where near their food sled: do the Vermillion muskies relate to the smallmouth in Vermillion Chad_Cain: Not that I have found. That would be too much energy to chase those little guys down Brandyn_Shepherd: After all that wind what would make them huddle up in one bay behind the island… The obvious answer would be to get out of the wind… but do you have any other suggestions? Brandyn_Shepherd tells you: sorry i thought i would just jump in cause it seemed like it was the right time. Chad_Cain: That was where the water was warmer, and it was no where near a moon rise/set or dusk. Just a waiting game!! GotOne: Do you troll much on Vermilion? Chad_Cain: no Brandyn_Shepherd tells you: thanks Slamr: Chad, Vermillion is a pretty big body of water, what do you suggest for someone spending their first trip there, beyond of course hiring you Steve_Worrall: Chad, if one wishes to book a day with your guide service, how would one reach you? laptop: most of the reefs you can hit are marked with buoys correct ? Chad_Cain: study lake maps, and hire a guide for sure. It took me seven years to crack the code on that lake!! sled: nope sled: watched a lower unit “event” at mach speed there as a kid madmusky: Chad are you a firm believer in the different lunar peroids? Chad_Cain: Matt Snyer aka Smiling Mallard is guiding for me this summer again on Vermilion. Chad_Cain: I don’t care what moon phase it is. Just makes the times of day that I fish different sled: how many can your guys handle if i did a customer outing Slamr: different how? Brandyn_Shepherd: Chad… do you belive Fishing Muskies relates to hunting out of a deer stand? Where it usually doesnt matter what you throw, just right time right place sort of deal? Pointerpride102: how many can fit in your boat chad? Chad_Cain: I never miss obvious feeding windows, and then try to hit the different weather patterns as well. That is why I never tell clients the hours until the night before our trip laptop: have any of your biggest fish come with say 20 min. of moonrise/moonset and do you believe that has any effect on fish??? Chad_Cain: You still need to throw a bait with a high hooking percentage. When you work your butt off to get a strike, make sure they get hooked! Brandyn_Shepherd: Is it true you have never caught a fish on topwater once the water reaches a certain temp? Dave_Jonesi: Hey Chad, how was the nite bite last summer on the Big V? sled: add a follow boat ? Chad_Cain: I hardly ever get fish on topwater once it exceeds their preferred water temp. That drives them deeper. Chad_Cain: I can arrange for four boats on Vermilion, and five on Kinkaid Brandyn_Shepherd: In July most of the fish were in 5-8 ft of water on the west end, but they still would not hit topwater. Is there any other reasons for it? Chad_Cain: They weren’t hungry yet Brandyn_Shepherd: haha alright Chad_Cain: These fish don’t feed all day long. They only get active during very short, distinct feeding windows. I have an article about that in Musky Hunter in this recent issue Slamr: Lets talk Musky Armor…..tell us a bit about why you got into this new business, and what your goals are (beyond $$$ of course) Chad_Cain: Moonrise/moonset is very important. Brandyn_Shepherd: Of course. laptop: what are the feeding windows you look for? how can you predict or tell when they are going to happen??? Mark_Hintz: Very comfortable shoes….Thanks Chad… Brandyn_Shepherd tells you: wow a lot of people show up for these chats. very good work you have done. Chad_Cain: So far we have shoes, gloves, and apparrel, and we also own Llungen Lures as well. Jomusky: when did you get LLungen? theedz: I like the shoes so far. Fit my WIDE feet well. Slamr: Musky shoes might sound foreign to alot of people, tell us why they’re “musky” shoes? Brandyn_Shepherd: The shoes are made by a company called Etnies by the way Pointerpride102: what make’s your shoes special? Chad_Cain: Muskie Armor is a company that is going to try its best to provide quality product at a price that the average fisheran can afford. Chad_Cain: They are rain-proof, and they are only 40 bucks Slamr: and the gloves? Jomusky: rain proof is very important! Pointerpride102: where can we see them? Chad_Cain: Good grip too, not for running shoes, just fishing. Steve_Worrall: tell us how the shoes keep the feet dry Brandyn_Shepherd: Chad… I saw that you guys had a long sleeve shirt at the show… Is it polyester? Is it rainproof? Chad_Cain: The gloves are great. I used them all last summer and fall, and they worked perfect. I am proud of those. THat will save a lot of peoples knuckles Chad_Cain: Water can’t get up through the sole, and there is a rain gutter on the sides of the laces to make any water drain out the front Snowcrest_6: might have to bu ya pair of the gloves….ended up with 3 stitches last fall…. Chad_Cain: They aren’t for teeth or hooks, just gill rakers Steve_Worrall: ahh the gutters, that’s waht I was looking for Rod_LaCaze: Chad any idea when the stuff will be online to look and order it? Mark_Hintz: Steve, those shoes are super comfortable, try a pair on at the next show your at. Chad_Cain: We will have the shoes at the Extreme MN show, and at Milwaukee, and Ohio Chad_Cain: We might not sell the shoes on-line. Not sure yet Brandyn_Shepherd: Chad… do you attend any fishing meetings when you go up to Lake Vermilion? Jomusky: when did you aquire LLungen? Chad_Cain: THe glove will be sold online once we get the site up Steve_Worrall: well,guess I’ll have to get a pair in Milwaukee! Chad_Cain: I got Llungen Lures in the beginning of December Jomusky: congratesSnowcrest_6: any affiliation with Ice Armor? sled: later guys … thanks Chad! Chad_Cain: I have always used and loved the baits as a pro-staffer for Keith, so it worked out great. Chad_Cain: no affiliation Jomusky: didn’t see much in the way of squirko’s at the show….more at the next ones? Jomusky: squirko put 6 fish in my boat in May muskyme: Smokey’s had some cool squirkos Chad_Cain: We are just working on getting a large inventory of Llungen Tales and Nut Buster Spinnerbaits first, then work on the rest smiling_mallard: awesome Jomusky BruceKY: Chad, What method(s) do you use to track down bait fish? electronics, cruising w big motor, past experience, etc Chad_Cain: Water temps, wind direction, electronics. and past experience Chad_Cain: birds too Brandyn_Shepherd: When will you have a website up for Llungen Lures? They are def. my favorite spinner type bait Jomusky: if I was to make a trip to Kinkaid or Shelbyville during the closed Wisconsin season, what month do you think would be best for each one? Chad_Cain: I love the Squirkos, and will be getting those done eventually. I think Keith is still selling those on the side under a different company for now Pointerpride102: are there any “college budget” places to stay near kinkaid? Chad_Cain: The musky armor and Llungen websites will be done by spring. Just not enough hours in the day right now. Too many fishing shows! lambeau: i know you talked shad a bit already, but do you have any suggestions for targeting muskies on a shad-based lake during the summer if you’re not allowed to troll? muskyme: I second the llungen tails as favorite …gave me my PB…it was cool having Keith building them at the show while you waitedChad_Cain: We dont fish shad reservoirs in the summer. water is too hot GotOne: Will you have the option for custom LLungen Tails at Milwaukee as well? pgaschulz has left the room. lambeau: well…up here in WI where it’s not that hot yet, any suggestions? madmusky: besides moonrise / set do you follow any of the major or minor peroids? Chad_Cain: Yes, but they will be pre-made from now on. We are coming up with some crazy customs for the show Pointerpride102: anyone know some super cheap places to sleep near kinkaid? Chad_Cain: Brandyn, it is already being take care of, thanks though Snowcrest_6: sleeping bag rolled out under the boat! Steve_Worrall: One more time, Chad,how wouldone reach youto book a dayof fishing? Chad_Cain: Shad in the summer will also be looking for water around 70 degrees Chad_Cain: my website at chadcain.com lambeau: so if suspended, will relate in the column based on temperature? Chad_Cain: 618-687-2244 for a hotel Pointerpride102: thanks Steve_Worrall: thanks, sir Chad_Cain: Any more questions? Slamr: what is the earliest inthe spring that one can come down, and still feel relatively sure the rains arent going to muck it up too bad? Pointerpride102: Chad, how many can you fit in your boat, and does the number of guys effect price Jomusky: what woiuld the best month be to try Kinkaid during the closed Wisconsin season, what about Shelbyville? Chad_Cain: That isn’t a problem any more on Kinkaid. That was when all the fish went up to Johnson Creek. Now they have stocked the fish in different areas of the lake and the fish are going back for spawning Chad_Cain: I only fit two clients in a boat with me. With the guide team, we can take quite a few Steve_Worrall: Chad,what are your preferred Rod and reel combos? Chad_Cain: March/April Slamr: who are the guides that make up your team? Chad_Cain: Thorne Bros rods, and I still can’t find a good enough reel Jomusky: I reallly enjoyed Chad’s footage on the Muskie Town DVD….way to be! Brandyn_Shepherd: Shimano Calcutta? Daiwa Luna? Abu C3? I cant seem to find a good enough reel either. I use mine 2-5 times a week all year long. Chad_Cain: Rodney LaCaze, Matt Snyder, Al Nutty, Andy Rametta, Scott Donovan, and Josh Ebersole for now. Might be adding Kevin Nash and Thad Hinshaw Duane: try the Penn International bait casters–great reels hold up very well Chad_Cain: It is a shame the crap they give us to use for reels. Period!!! Steve_Worrall: quite a stable! Slamr: what shows are you, Llungen and Musky Armor going to be at through the winter? smiling_mallard: agreed Chad_Cain: Duane, I will try the Penn Internationals Brandyn_Shepherd: Sorry if it was covered, but is there a way to find Musky Armor online? Chad_Cain: not yet, but check in on my website Steve_Worrall: Penns are near bulletproof under saltwater use Steve_Worrall: tough reels Slamr: any more questions before the clock strikes 9? Chad_Cain: I will try them, because nothing I have tried holds up for more than a month or two Duane: Hey guys-Dont forget that Musky Armor is also offering Ocean Waves glasses at a great price! Dave_Jonesi: yep, but they still will go down Steve_Worrall: what line do you use, pound test and brand? Jomusky: got some waves on Saturday, Thanks for the great deal Chad_Cain: Cortland Spectron in 80lb green Snowcrest_6: is there a rhy me or reason to the different lense colors? Applications for each type? Chad_Cain: I have used it for nine years now Brandyn_Shepherd: Chad… if you could only have 3 rods… what would the specs be and what baits would they be fore? Snowcrest_6: i know there is but….can’t remember which is for what Chad_Cain: The backwater green lense is specifically made to see in water madmusky: what blanks are your thorne bros rods built on? Jomusky: why do you choose to spend soo much time on Vermillion over Mille Lacs or Canada? Snowcrest_6: all types of water chad? clear, stained, in- between…? Chad_Cain: yes Slamr: Its 9PM, MuskieFIRST gives our deepest appreciation for spending your time with us tonight, great seminar! Thanks again! Chad_Cain: Diamond Back. the best blank I have tried yet Steve_Worrall: Thanks,sir! Snowcrest_6: 9 bells….thanks for your time, chad Chad_Cain: Your welcome!